[0:03]
once again thanks for chatting to us about all things church planning now one of the big questions we have particularly in the year where which everybody is thinking about Anzac Day it's our 100th year celebration of commemoration if you like the landing in Gallipoli what place are these sort of big cultural events what place do they have in their church planning life how can we use them or are they really something that's a distraction yeah well interesting you mention the Anzac Day thing I you know at one level

[0:34]
you don't want to use it you want to pay respect and be together with others giving thanks for people who have sacrificed their lives and so on so there's a level of which some of those events are not to be used they just do we are we we seek to honor and so but at another level of course Anzac Day is a an indicator of water strays that says something about Australian air culture but sort of other cultural events to moments not just Anzac Day it's some

[1:04]
being RL it's a cultural event you know the State of Origin the the cultural events it's interesting we do often run to the high culture you know the more sophisticated cultures things but the festival over the while do you mean that's a cultural event it's it's not an Australian cultural event but it's a subculture I think and all of these things are windows into for us who want to reach people their windows into reaching people yeah who are those people we're seeking to

[1:36]
reach so yeah they have they have a place I guess I guess tea or 3 3 3 things that have a place so it helps me understand who it is I'm seeking to reach helps me get alongside them it helps me know better how to speak into that world there's a few thoughts but but interestingly – I am I meant for me you know I grew up in a cultural event it was the beach you know was kind of like the surf world

[2:07]
these are culture that's an it's an event it's an experience so I've spent so long immersed in that world you know I needed to drive past it now just to get reminder of that culture and get a taste of it again so Anzac Day for me is not kind of the the big event for me to go to if I was from another country coming to Australia I was wanting to understand and get alongside and so on I'd want to pay attention to those things there are some limitations I think so Anzac Day it really is only a

[2:42]
small window into the Australian psyche did you know it's and you know I I can only gain so much insight from from seeing those things the nrmn I'd go to the grand final will go to a a soccer soccer game what is that that's just revealing my culture here football these things are a small windows when they're only small windows so there are limitations with my ability to understand and then get alongside of so

[3:12]
that I might get some insight but to be to be a person who can really walk with someone who resolved that world and culture the festival a while is a classic so that I can go along and I can see what that subculture of Australia is like to some degree but to me to me to be able to get alongside them and be who they are and what we think it really is very difficult for me to do that because hipster do you know that's a cultural

[3:42]
community subculture I bring too much of my cultural baggage to be able to engage effectively into that I need to find the ones who are closer in there's limitations to I think there's another little warning come on I think you need to do these things with much respect and affection so if I'm going to be involved in cultural events to understand and get alongside I need to do with respect and affection for the best of that I'm seeing in those cultural events so it is too easy to become pretentious above and

[4:13]
look down on and critique and dismiss but is it serious Lewis has that insight that a lot of things that we pursue in our culture's are actually they arise from deep longings within us and to see in any particular cultural expression those deep longings is important so affection and respect for a team carnation its Jesus becomes one with us well that is an expression of real love the third thing last thing I'd say is

[4:49]
you want to cut there of just do I can do a if you just pick up from the third thing tonight you throw a question in the middle factor third yeah okay so awareness is one of the key factors but not overstating the importance of making it everything I guess on a practical level you're at least saying if you're parachuting in go visit your local tourism office and know exactly what the key cultural events are for that community in that area yeah if you're if

[5:23]
you're from outside that subculture then of course you want to find all the kinds of ways to know and understand and get under the skin of the people I'm connecting to I'm kind of interested though that you said that there's some cultures you can't see you could actually get inside of and you said just in passing I need to find those people who can what do you mean by that yeah see if it's interesting because I've spent my life in books now do so I

[5:57]
grew up in that a certain world which is the knockabout head nestea do what you want to do each world I grew up in that world that I've now spent 25 years pursuing disciplined rigorous Thord academic study and analysis do you know I just I just subtly say and do things that are now disconnected from that

[6:28]
culture the words I think to use that I never would have thought to use it's just that my humors shifted all kinds of things you know just because you will become a dad yeah now I'm just exhausted because I'm a dad but yeah there's all kinds of things that are really quite profoundly different about Who I am but a subtle you know why I see the New Age movement the way I think about the festival the Wow it's just it comes from different

[6:58]
place whereas if I'm going to reach those people I've got to be aware of my own limitations now which is the expression of limitations and and find those that are still close enough into it that they they they see the positives in a way that I can't they speak the words that I wouldn't they have the jokes that I would they dress the way it's absolutely critical for me to be aware it's Hudson Taylor isn't it's kind of there's only so much a European can immerse themselves into a different culture he needed to actually find the

[7:29]
converts from that culture captured them the gospel they have to go back into that world much closer to it but if I can jump in the but the principle whether it be you or whether it the person you're talking about is to remember that there's an incarnation allow you with these things that the best things that might rise out of these cultural events really are just when you save with fractions or reflections of God's character yeah I think there's the third thing I pick up on is there are deeper structures to humankind that

[8:00]
transcend culture subculture so that and there's where we need to be immersed in the scriptures it's you know it's Calvin's wonderful inside of that I know myself when I know God better and I know God better when I know myself it's that interplay between those things and so ultimately the way I serve whatever culture or subculture I'm engaged in ultimately the way I serve them best is to know God best so know myself and know humankind in its deepest structures do you know what are the yearnings of the

[8:30]
human heart what are the what how is depravity impact the human kind where do those things express themselves so I'm more attuned to seeing them in these cultural artifacts those events so I can actually I can discern more readily not just the deep yearning of the image of God that's still there but also the perversion of the fall that's the and I can pick all those things up and but do it from a context of a heart of God who loves his world the fallen world

[9:00]
the rebellious world and so do with some affection and warmth towards those people I'm seeking a rich and not as the Prudential over them seeing what they can't see you